[acb-hsp] Working withculturYandLinguisticYDiversePopulations

Mon Oct 17 17:05:14 EDT 2011

That's really really sad.
Sharon

-----Original Message-----
From: acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf Of
JRAYL
Sent: Monday, October 17, 2011 3:13 PM
To: acb-hsp at acb.org
Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working withculturYandLinguisticYDiversePopulations

Oral Roberts may be well-known for this attitude, however there are many,
many others out there just like him.

Jessie 

----- Original Message -----
From: Baracco, Andrew W <Andrew.Baracco at va.gov>
To: "Discussion list for ACB human service professionals" <acb-hsp at acb.org>
Date: Monday, Oct 17, 2011 01:51:25 PM
Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working withculturYandLinguisticYDiversePopulations

>
>
> Tell that to Oral Roberts!  Oh! I forgot! He's dead!
> As a small child, my former wife was taken to Oral Roberts by her mother
> in hope that her blindness could be healed.  Rev. Roberts told her
> mother that he couldn't heal her daughter because God was punishing her
> mother because of the sins that she had committed. Now, her mother was
> no angel, and was aware that she had lived a far less than perfect life.
> Rev. Roberts not only failed to heal this little girl, but sent her
> mother into a depression that he never recovered from.
> 
> Andy
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf
> Of Sharon
> Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2011 3:50 PM
> To: 'Discussion list for ACB human service professionals'
> Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working
> withculturYandLinguisticYDiversePopulations
> 
> The issue is centered in responsible Biblical exegetical and
> hermeneutical
> methodology.
> In John 9, Jesus makes it clear that sin and punishment are not the
> issue
> with pwd's. In terms of the gay issue, the preponderance of evidence is
> on
> the side of there being a moral issue here, though the moral issue is
> quite
> similar to the moral issue inherent in any sex outside of marriage.
> 
> To fully answer the line, I'd have to go through every Biblical passage,
> which I do not have time to do.
> 
> And if someone believes that having a disability is linked to sin or
> punishment, would I really want them as my counselor?
> 
> Sharon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf
> Of
> J.Rayl
> Sent: Friday, October 14, 2011 10:34 AM
> To: Discussion list for ACB human service professionals
> Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working with
> culturYandLinguisticYDiversePopulations
> 
> So, if nondisabled people say this to people with disabilities, it is
> okay 
> then?
> Just curious how this works and with whom it applies in your mind.
> 
> Jessie Rayl
> thedogmom63 at frontier.com
> www.facebook.com/Eaglewings10
> www.pathtogrowth.org
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Sharon" <mt281820 at comcast.net>
> To: "'John Kolwick'" <john2109 at suddenlink.net>; "'Discussion list for
> ACB 
> human service professionals'" <acb-hsp at acb.org>
> Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 9:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working with culturally 
> andLinguisticYDiversePopulations
> 
> 
> I think there are times when it's permissible to just tell the client
> that
> you are uncomfortable or that your values are different from theirs and
> that
> they may prefer to work with someone whose values are more closely
> aligned
> to their own. They will most likely pick up on differences in values
> anyway.
> Sharon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf
> Of
> John Kolwick
> Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 8:19 PM
> To: Discussion list for ACB human service professionals
> Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Working with culturally and
> LinguisticYDiversePopulations
> 
>    I agree with Jessie's comments regarding our roles and what we need
> to do
> 
> in regard to interactions with others that we may not agree with or feel
> comfortable with.  What is interesting in this case is that this student
> got
> 
> to the near end of her program and ran into this type of conflict.
> Wonder
> why she did not have to cope with these circumstances prior to her
> internship. I have known a number of counselors who would project there
> own
> values in to their work with others.  This would be an interesting case
> for
> court TV when it gets there.
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: J.Rayl
> Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 7:14 PM
> To: Discussion list for ACB human service professionals
> Subject: [acb-hsp] Working with culturally and Linguistically
> DiversePopulations
> 
> Again, your professional code of ethics tells you precisely what to do
> and
> how to handle personal biases and values with clients.  We are not to
> impose
> our personal views and values on our clients.  Therefore, it makes
> absolutely no difference what I, Jessie, believe about homosexuality,
> abortion, people with disabilities, radial-ethnic people different from
> my
> own, etc.
> I am to be culturally competent and open to worldviews different from my
> own.
> My level of "comfortableness" is of no concern to the client nor should
> it
> be.  It is Jessie's problem, and something with which Jessie needs to
> either
> work through herself or work through with a supervisor.
> There is a huge! difference between that vs. lack of training /
> education.
> And we, as professionals, or not to provide services for clients with
> whom
> we've had no training / experience unless we believe we can do so
> competently.  However! we are not just to say, well I have a problem
> with
> abortion or homosexuality, and therefore I"full receive no training in it
> or
> I'll simply not be open to it.
> I had not worked with middle eastern clients either, however I assumed
> I'd
> get to know / understand them in working with them -comand I did.
> If a person is so biased, regardless of what reason (E.g., ignorance,
> fear,
> religious dictates) then, again, they really need to either stick to
> their
> own community biases (e.g., provide only Biblical counseling), or find
> another profession.
> Sorry but the professional codes are clear on this and clients have a
> valid
> complaint if treated otherwise.
> No one forces an individual into this field after all; however, many
> clients
> are forced into our offices.
> 
> 
> 
> Jessie Rayl
> thedogmom63 at frontier.com
> www.facebook.com/Eaglewings10
> www.pathtogrowth.org
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "peter altschul" <paltschul at centurytel.net>
> To: "Discussion list for ACB human service professionals"
> <acb-hsp at acb.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 6:58 PM
> Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Remediation That the Tolerant Left Won't Tolerate
> 
> 
> Hi:
> 
> As I understand things, fundamentalist Christians believe that
> only one man and one woman can be married, and that all other
> relationships where sex is involved are sinful, and assisting
> unmarried couples to strengthen their relationship without
> getting married is encouraging sinful behavior.  And I also think
> it worth noting that the author clearly states that this has
> nothing to do with LGBT issues.
> 
> Personally, I think the author has a point although it does
> create some discomfort; for example, should counselors
> uncofortable with PWDS not be required to work with them?
> Shouldn't we counselors be encouraged to step outside of our
> "comfort zone?"  And where's the line between discomfort and a
> lack of skill?
> 
> When I was working towards my MSW, the school faculty barely hid
> their contempt when it came to religion and conservative
> politics.  If we are going to encourage people to stretch, then
> professors must be good role models.
> 
> Best, Peter
> 
> 
> 
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Lisa Gorden-Cushman" <crysania at sbcglobal.net
> >To: "'Discussion list for ACB human service professionals'"
> <acb-hsp at acb.org
> >Date sent: Tue, 11 Oct 2011 10:53:26 com0700
> >Subject: Re: [acb-hsp] Remediation That the Tolerant Left Won't
> Tolerate
> 
> >The problem with the logic about her sexual orientation being not
> important
> >is that her client never had the legal right to marry, so he
> could not be
> >within her value system, even if he wanted to.
> 
> >Best regards,
> >Lisa
> 
> 
> 
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-hsp-bounces at acb.org] On
> Behalf Of
> >peter altschul
> >Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2011 7:24 AM
> >To: Acbhsp
> >Subject: [acb-hsp] Remediation That the Tolerant Left Won't
> Tolerate
> 
> >Remediation for those the tolerant left won't tolerate
> >  David Cortman
> >  In January 2009, Julea Ward, who is a Christian, was a graduate
> >student in the counseling program at Eastern Michigan University.
> >She was nearing the end of the program and had accumulated a 3.91
> >GPA.  Then she was expelled.
> >  Why? Well, EMU asked her to counsel a client in a manner that
> >would have violated her Biblically-based faith and values.
> >Following standard profession practice, she asked her supervising
> >professor whether it would be okay to reassign the client to a
> >different counselor.  EMU expelled her from the program for
> >making this simple referral request, and because of the religious
> >beliefs that motivated it.
> >  Unfortunately, media reports on Ward's lawsuit often claim that
> >EMU expelled her for refusing to counsel gay clients.  This is
> >simply untrue.  She asked for the referral because her religious
> >beliefs prevent her from providing counseling on any non-marital
> >sexual relationship.  This means Ward would raise the same values
> >conflict regardless of the sexual orientation of the client
> >seeking such assistance.
> >  Put simply, Ward would raise the same conflict and seek a
> >referral regardless of whether the client was homosexual and
> >seeking counseling on a non-marital sexual relationship (which is
> >the context in which her referral request arose) or if the client
> >was heterosexual and seeking counseling on a non-marital sexual
> >relationship.  The "gay animus" angle often seen in media reports
> >is dead wrong.
> >  It is also important to note that referrals, including those
> >based on values conflicts, are common and accepted in the
> >counseling profession.  The code of ethics for the profession
> >contains two provisions endorsing the practice of referring
> >clients.  Ward acted consistent with these provisions, and with
> >the advice of her supervising professor, by having a client
> >reassigned in a situation where she believed another counselor
> >would be better suited to meet his needs.  The profession is,
> >after all, most concerned with serving the best interests of
> >clients.  And sometimes, a client's best interests are served by
> >working with a different counselor.
> >  Rather than approving Ward's simple request to refer a single
> >client, EMU initiated disciplinary proceedings against her.  EMU
> >also informed Ward that the only way she could remain in the
> >counseling program was if she agreed to undergo a "remediation"
> >program aimed at changing her "belief system."
> >  Unsurprisingly, Ward declined the "remediation" program.  And
> >who would agree to such a thing? It is hard to imagine any
> >student agreeing to change their beliefs as a condition to
> >getting their degree.
> >  In addition to the Orwellian "remediation" program, the
> >disciplinary proceedings also involved EMU professors putting
> >Ward's religious beliefs on trial.
> >  For example, during Ward's final disciplinary hearing, Suzanne
> >Dugger, one of EMU's counseling faculty, asked Ms.  Ward whether
> >she viewed her "brand of Christianity as superior" to other
> >Christians who may disagree with her.  And Perry Francis, another
> >EMU faculty member, told Ward he was going to take her on a
> >btheological boutb and then directly attacked her understanding
> >and interpretation of scripture.
> >  Throughout these things, Ward remained steadfast, refusing to
> >abandon her religious convictions or violate them as a condition
> >to getting her degree.
> >  What is amazing about Ward's situation is EMU's harsh and
> >drastic reaction to her request to refer a single client.  Rather
> >than honoring Ward's simple request (which, again, was consistent
> >with the professional standards regarding referral), EMU expelled
> >an academically stellar student and, in the process of doing so,
> >targeted and attacked the religious beliefs that motivated her
> >referral request and told her she had to change them to get her
> >degree.
> >  Now, instead of being a Christian and a graduate student at
> >EMU, Ward is but another Christian whom the tolerant left will
> >not tolerate.
> >  David Cortman serves as senior legal counsel with the Alliance
> >Defense Fund at its Atlanta Regional Service Center in Georgia,
> >where he heads litigation efforts to defend and reclaim the First
> >Amendment rights of public school students across the nation.
> >Cortman joined ADF in 2005, and is admitted to the bar in
> >Georgia, Florida, and the District of Columbia.  He has practiced
> >law since 1996 and graduated magna cum laude from the Regent
> >University School of Law, where he earned his J.D.
> >_______________________________________________
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Jessie Rayl, MA, LPC, ALPS
www_pathtogrowth_org
thedogmomffcc%frontier_com
304-671-9780  
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