[bscb-l] snow removal

Wed Mar 24 21:18:25 GMT 2010

The sidewalk usually belongs to the city or town you are in.  If you live on a street called a "private way," then the sidewalks might be part of that, in which case the sidewalks on that particular street would belong to the neighborhood association that owns the private way (not to any individual homeowner or business).  If you have walkways leading from the sidewalk to your front door, then of course these walkways are usually part of your private property, but they're not really called "sidewalks" so that's not what I'm talking about--obviously homeowners should shovel their own private walkways, but that's a different issue than the public sidewalks, because other people don't have to walk on your private walkways unless they are visiting your private property, whereas many of us have to walk on the public sidewalk to get to various public places like bus stops, etc. So the cities and towns should be responsible for making sure that their public sidewalks are safe and clear, and the neighborhood associations that own private ways should make sure that their sidewalks are also safe and clear (just as they now do for the roads). And private homeowners should be responsible for clearing their own private property only--and that does not include the public sidewalks or the roads.  

--Alison

----- Original Message -----
From: "Annmarie Strazzullo" <a.strazzullo at yahoo.com>
To: "Bay state (Massachusetts) discussion list" <bscb-l at acb.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 5:03:21 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [bscb-l] snow removal

Alison, the sidewalks in front of people's homes and/or businesses belongs to 
the owners.

Annmarie
***
Music is a healing force all living spirits sing.--Joanna Shenandoah, Oneida 
composer
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alison" <alison2911 at comcast.net>
To: "Bay state (Massachusetts) discussion list" <bscb-l at acb.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [bscb-l] snow removal

No, it does not apply if the sidewalk is public property and you did not do 
anything to create the dangerous situation.  Homeowners are responsible for 
their own private property, not for public property that happens to be nearby. 
Homeowners insurance covers the homeowner's private property, not the public 
property around it.  The only time a private person would be responsible for a 
hazard on public property is if the person actually caused the hazard--and 
nobody except God can cause it to snow.

--Alison

----- Original Message -----
From: "alice dampman Humel" <alicedh at verizon.net>
To: "Bay state (Massachusetts) discussion list" <bscb-l at acb.org>, "Annmarie 
Strazzullo" <a.strazzullo at yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 3:34:15 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [bscb-l] snow removal

The homeowner has indeed caused the dangerous situation by not clearing the
sidewalk in front of his house.
Annmarie is not wrong about this. You as a homeowner can be sued if someone
falls on the public sidewalk in front of your house through your negligence,
and leaving ice and snow on that sidewalk is negligent. Check your
homeowner's insurance policy.
Alice
alicedh at verizon.net
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alison" <alison2911 at comcast.net>
To: "Annmarie Strazzullo" <a.strazzullo at yahoo.com>; "Bay state
(Massachusetts) discussion list" <bscb-l at acb.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 2:24 PM
Subject: Re: [bscb-l] snow removal

> The homeowner is only responsible if you fall on a walkway that is part of
> his or her private property, not the public sidewalk.  The homeowner would
> only be responsible for your falling on the public sidewalk if he or she
> has actually caused the dangerous situation, like if he or she has
> actually shoveled snow onto the sidewalk or something like that--otherwise
> the law would not force homeowners to pay if you fell on the snow or ice
> on the public sidewalk.  So you are wrong about that one.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Annmarie Strazzullo" <a.strazzullo at yahoo.com>
> To: "Bay state (Massachusetts) discussion list" <bscb-l at acb.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 1:43:59 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
> Subject: Re: [bscb-l] snow removal
>
>
>
> You also realize that should someone not clean off the snow in front of
> their house and you fall and injure yourself, the home owner could be
> responsible.
>
>
> Annmarie
> ***
> Music is a healing force all living spirits sing.--Joanna Shenandoah,
> Oneida composer
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: alice dampman Humel
> To: bscb-l at acb.org
> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 1:18 PM
> Subject: [bscb-l] snow removal
>
>
>
> Actually, many cities and towns in many states have and successfully
> enforce ordinances that require people to shovel out their sidewalks. I
> think the fines should be raised to much higher levels to "encourage"
> people to clear their sidewalks. Many cities and towns simply tack the
> fines onto the homeowner's tax bill.
> The solution to the problem of disabled homeowners is called "exemption."
> They apply and are exempted from the ordinance.
> How many homeowners and/or renters refuse to shovel their sidewalks, but
> are perfectly capable of shoveling out their precious cars, parking spots,
> and driveways and leave a 5 foot high mound of snow right smack in the
> middle of their unshoveled sidewalks making walkking on the sidewalk an
> impossibility? It may be possible to slog through an unshoveled sidewalk,
> but it is not possible to get past these mounds without going out into the
> street, and of course with all the snow, one has to go further out into
> the street than for a non-snow off-curb obstacle, thus endangering both
> person and dog, if there is a dog.
> Technically, you are correct that the sidewalks are city property, and
> that the city is responsible for keeping them in good repair (and they
> can't even manage to do *that* much of the time). But as a homeowner, one
> has responsibilities that transcend the tecchnicalities, and it would not
> be possible for a city or town to clear all the residential sidewalks.
> Of course, in a place like the former Soviet Union, the sidewalks in
> residential areas were indeed cleared by government crews, but I can hearr
> the conservatives screaming "socialism" all the way from here.
> Additionally, European urban landscapes are quite different from American
> ones. Very few people own one-family homes inn the cities or what we call
> suburbs, and there are more apartment buildings, so that social structure
> is different as well.
> There are many solutions to this problem, but I doubt the current American
> social, political or economic climate would embrace any of them.
> I do agree about the snow plows, though, and they leave those
> insurmountable mounds on streets and at corners. And because those mounds
> are so enormous, they stay around for months.
> There's another problem involved with snow that we might as well
> address...in for a penny, in for a pound. And that is the grossly extreme
> overuse of chemical melting compounds on the streets and sidewalks that
> turn them into vast oceans of caustic slush and muck. God, I'd rather deal
> with ice and snow than with that sludge.
> Alice
>
>
> alicedh at verizon.net
> alicedh at verizon.net
>
>
>
>
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