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10401-ACB’s 2023 Leadership Conference
The Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act
February 28, 2023

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This file was created in real time by a Certified Realtime Captioner for the purpose of communication access. It is not a certified legal transcript and may not be entirely verbatim. It is intended for use by the consumer only as notes of the proceedings. A consumer should check with the presenter for any clarification of the presentation.

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Live Captioner on stand-by 4:20 p.m. PST 
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Are we ready?  Hello and welcome to another live episode of the ACB advocacy update.  Coming to you through the ACB community.  As well as being streamed in Club House, and over the ACB Media network.  I'm excited to say, we are broadcasting in English and as well as Spanish interpretation.  And with CART captioning.  
My name is Clark Rachfal.  And I'm the director of advocacy and affairs.  I'm joined with my colleague and co-host.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Hi I'm Swatha I'm a --
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: This evening, we are continuing our series of community events debuting the ACB legislative imperatives for 2023.  This is event three out of 4.  
So we have already discussed the exercise and fitness for all act.  As well as the medical device non-visual accessibility act.  The DC Leadership Conference, they are actually, still time to register folks.  This is February 28, registration closes today.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: At midnight Eastern.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: E-mail Nancy or Karen.  Ask forgiveness it is late in the day.  You could still register for the virtual portion of the leadership conference that will take place Saturday, March fourth, this Saturday through Tuesday March 7.  As well as in-person portion of the leadership conference that will take place Thursday March 9-12.  Anything else going on with the in-person portion that folks may be interested.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: The currency rally.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: The currency rally.  What is that?  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: So we are having a rally a protest on the steps of the White House.  Treasury building.  To ask for currency for folks and issues that have been going on for 20 years plus.  Come join us.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Exactly.  So as we mentioned, this is our third imperative event.  And we will provide overview of the Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act.  
To provide an overview of the Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act, I'll turn to my colleague Swatha Nandhakumar.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yes.  So what this bill is the Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act, this Bill introduced late last year in September in the Fall.  
And it needs to be reintroduced.  What the bill does it will create standards for websites and applications.  People with disabilities.  This Bill -- defines disability in a functional way and not in a -- standard or to directive.  
So Clark you want to tell us the definition in disability is?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely, Swatha.  So there is two ways to think about how in a legislative approach you can try to require accessibility.  We could look towards something like the web content accessibility guidelines.  Which many folks know.  And are very appreciative for.  Also, referred to as WCAG or WCAG.  These are prescriptive international standards.  There is a standard for font, contrast, for screen reader accessibility.  And there is -- there are different metrics where you -- it is like a binary choice depending on the level of the requirement.  It could be a thumbs up or a thumbs down.  
A functional definition operates a little differently.  So for example, when in the American Disabilities With Disabilities Act we have a requirement more effective communication.  For people that are blind and low vision or Deaf and hard-of-hearing.  
Affective communication means that you need to be able to provide equal access to communicate with people that are disabled.  It doesn't tell you how you have to effectively communicate.  There is any number of ways that you effectively communicate.  That could be through alternative methods.  It could be through the use of auxiliary aides and services.  But the requirement of affective communication is the functional definition component.  It is kind of the aspirational goal.  That is where we are looking towards here with a functional definition of accessibility.  This legislation doesn't tell government, or businesses or employers you must do A, B, C.  And you will be -- you will get a badge or gold star or smiley face for being accessible.  What the functional definition says, is that you need to provide equal access for people with disabilities.  So that they could have the same access with the same level of privacy and the same level of independence as the people that are not disabled.  We see it in the Communication and Disability Act.  The CCAA talks about accessibility user interfaces for wireless phones or land line phones or user interfaces doesn't prescribe how you provide the equal access to advance communication services, it doesn't mandate the specific method or technology to be used.  
It says, hey service provider, this is on you.  Do what you feel is the best for you business.  With this being that end goal.  That is what we inspire to hear with the functional definition.  We don't want to be descriptive we want to make sure that people with disabilities have access.  What will flow once the legislation is passed, what will stem from the legislation is enforceable regulations made by the rule-makings at the Department of Justice and the equal employment opportunity commission.  Those regulations will be more prescriptive than the functional definition.  Why is that the case in because it is easier to update and change regulations than it is to change legislation.  Think of it this way, the ADA was passed in 1990.  If we had done it in 1990 that a wireline phone must be used over the copper phone network.  The public switched telephone network to provide voice communications for people that are blinded.  We are left in the dust.  
We don't want to put into legislation something that could not evolve as, technology evolves.  We want to access the same technologies and same benefits, privileges, and advantages as everyone else.  That is why it is important to keep a functional definition in the legislation.  
Swatha.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yeah.  We really want the standards to keep pace with new technology.  So it allows us -- creates or sets a study on newer technology to make sure that our standards keep pace.  And also should have an account to define disability in this definition.  So it is really -- really want this Bill -- these (indiscernible) you could say to be contingent of all (indiscernible) you don't want it done in three years.  So it was introduced last year in the Senate.  And congressman in the House.  So we really are pushing for the bill to be introduced.  We ask that you call your Congress about the issue and about the importance of the Bill.  Clark you want to talk about more about advocacy.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely Swatha, thank you.  Why is the bill important and why now?  Websites and applications have been around for quite a while.  
Honestly, it is something that should have been done.  Many years ago.  It is something that ACB, our partner at AFB and AER and other organizations tried to do for the blind and low vision community.  Back in 2010 there were conversations about amending and modernizing the ADA Amendments Act.  As time progressed and we notice throughout the COVID-19 pandemic, many more things are shifting online.  
If we think about the past two years, let's see, ACB there is a little thing called the ACB Community.  That went from holding one or two Zoom calls a month to now holding over 100 per week.  
Telehealth, being able to have virtual doctor's appointments.  Has exploded.  In popularity.  Distance learning, remote education, online schooling.  Whether for kindergarten through 12th grade or at the University level.  Is a staple of our education system now.  
And for those of us that have been fortunate enough to maintain employment throughout the pandemic, we all have to adjust to work from home.  Working remotely.  And some of us adjusted so well we are not going back to an office ever again.  We know friends and family or loved-ones who are making that decision.  
So why shouldn't people with disabilities have access to the same benefits?  
Those same privileges and advantages as the rest of the population?  We certainly deserve it.  It is our right to have equal access.  To whether it is government services, or the services and benefits or the tools resources we need to do our job through our employer, to take part in education, healthcare, heck, entertainment, civic engagement, whatever it is.  
So many aspects of our lives are just as if not, more readily available online.  Then they have been ever before.  Swatha we are not factoring in transportation yet.  Just like how difficult is it to be fully engaged in the real physical world.  For many of our members.  So the virtual built environment offers unparalleled access when it is designed to be accessible from the start.  
So why -- why do we think legislation?  Why do we think advocacy in the space is necessary?  Part of it is that although I say it is unsettled question.  How the ADA applies to the virtual built environment.  There is no question that the ADA applies to the physical built environment.  Curb cuts, ramps and doors and Braille signage.  Things like that.  What about the virtual built environment?  
In some cases, literally, court cases, depending where you are in the country, some courts think that the ADA applies to the internet.  Other courts say no, not so fast.  There needs to be a connection to the physical word or nexus to the physical world for the ADA to cover websites.  That creates confusion and uncertainty.  
Fortunately the Department of the Justice is consistent in their guidance since the mid-90s the ADA applies to websites.  The internet is not just websites.  We have websites, applications, online services, portals, the meta verse, virtual augmented reality, what about all of that stuff?  There is a whole bunch of things out there that are more than just websites.  
Also, the Department of Justice although they say the ADA applies to the internet they have not created regulations to say where, when, how that applies.  So this again, goes back to the uncertainty that exists.  We are confident the ADA applies there is no clear rules of the road with people with disabilities to enforce their rights.  For ACB to advocate on behalf of our members and businesses and employers' out there that want to do the right thing, but say they don't know how.  
Because there is not clear guidance.  Now, fortunately, the Department of Justice does have on the calendar for May of 2023, to start a rule-making.  For Title II of the ADA that covers state and local governments.  That still leaves out Title III, that leaves out public accommodation.  That is a lot of things.  
Whether it is again, entertainment, healthcare, transportation, and so on.  
Restaurants, e-commerce, etcetera, etcetera.  So also, we have been down this road with the Department of Justice saying they will do a rule-making before.  They said that in 2010.  That continued through 2015.  President Obama Administration ended.  President's Trump began.  With a new President and new priorities that rule-making was never completed.  Here we are with a new rule-making starting.  That needs to be completed by the end of 2024.  That will provide clarity.  
But Title III still remains.  The legislation still remains a vital advocacy tool.  Swatha it is not only important for people that are blind and low vision it is important for the entire disability community.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yes.  So this -- there have been many instances for other disabilities not just blindness that could access barriers.  You need captioning for video or interpretation you might not -- you are not -- just captioning.  The video players may not support it.  There is no standard set that cover that.  
If you use a twitch for the computer.  That doesn't work with websites always.  As they are built now.  So what the bill is trying to do is encompass and include all equal people with disabilities not just the blind and low vision.  This issue is important to the community and united in -- that something that needs to be changed.  Back to you, Clark.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Exactly.  For those reasons, there are more than 100 organizations national, state, local.  From the blindness, physical disability, the speech cognitive, mobility dexterity communities, sensory communities, that are supporting this legislation along with the American Council for the Blind.  As you work with your state affiliates to schedule meetings with your members of Congress, your, Representatives and U.S. Senators, encourage them to support and co-sponsor the Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act.  
Let them know what it would mean to you to have equal access to all of the same benefits, resources, and advantages that everyone else takes advantage of on a daily bases.  Help us advocate to ensure that the physical built environment, the accessibility that exists in the physical built environment, carries over to the virtual built environment.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Clark you think we are ready for questions?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: I think so Swatha, let's do it.  With our wonderful Zoom hosts here, this evening, we have multiple ways for folks to submit or be recognized for questions.  
Deb or somebody else can you provide an overview how we will do QA this evening?  
>>  Sure, Clark.  We have the regular Zoom.  Webinar option to raise your hand and Sheila is managing that for us this evening.  You are pretty familiar with that.  She will let you -- she will give you the unmute button.  We have Bill in Club House.  You are joining us there.  You could follow the procedures we use over there to raise your hand.  Be recognized.  You prefer to use the written QA box on your screen, that is something we are experimenting with to use in certain events and possibly this summer in the convention.  You like to experiment with that, you can tab over to that.  
And submit a question in the box.  
>>  All right.  Campbell is first.  
>>  All right.  Well, here we are again.  Good evening Clark and Swatha.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Hi Ray.  
>>  I want to share something with our members.  Someone that works in this technology accessibility every day.  I think what I would want to share with all of you as you are talking with your, Representatives, one of the -- push backs you might get it, well what standards are there that we could have companies follow?  We have standards.  The web contact accessibility guidelines we are on AA standard.  That is not only applies to websites but a lot of the principles in there could apply to applications, to mobile apps, to other things besides websites.  So I think, that you want to reference those.  As a guideline, standard that could be followed.  The Department of Transportation thinks it is a good standard they required airlines to make their airlines accessibility with the web content accessibility guidelines.  Don't let anyone tell you there is no standards to follow.  
That is something that one of the issues I think we heard over the years, well what standards do I follow to make things accessible?  The other thing I would say to -- as you talk to your members, is that, you know, it is -- that, you know, it is -- Department of Justice as Clark and Swatha stated, have done everything but put the rules out there.  
They -- and the courts are siding tending to say the ADA Title III does apply.  Robles vs Domino's a couple years ago, said that Domino's website and app needed to be accessible.  The third point I would make, especially it comes to things like online shopping.  You know, talk about the fact that you know transportation can be a barrier to getting out and doing -- getting the things you need.  So much easier to do online shopping.  
And all of those sites need to be accessible.  Like, for example, Amazon has done a pretty good job of making things accessible.  So just wanted to make those points.  And wish everybody a good luck on their advocacy work
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Thanks Ray.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Thank you so much Ray from the great State of Illinois and home of Senator Tammy Duckworth the Senate sponsor for the legislation.  
>>  Yeah.  
>>  All right.  775.  Ending in 653 you may speak.  
>>  Good evening from Reno, Nevada.  This is Dora I'm an explorer for ICB.  Thank you Swatha and Clark for a great job.  We are going -- our -- I'm starting a support group.  Not yet a chapter.  A support group.  We are calling ourselves, the Explorers.  We will be meeting with Jacqui and maybe Katherine Cortez our Senator and the House Representative.  Mark.  So I appreciate the web content.  That we had 2.1.  I was trying to see our backup to support this (inaudible) that we're doing.  My question to you folks, is there a letter, standard letter where our members and NCB could get in and fill in the names and what it is about basically?  And then that way we could send them sort of uniformed.  Because we try to do our -- we tried to write a letter ourselves but some members are not very well informed.  They don't want to say the wrong thing to represent ACB as a whole.  Thank you.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely.  That was Dora the Explorer from Nevada.  
>>  Yes sir.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Making sure I got that correct.  
>>  Thank you.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: We will be happy, to follow-up with assisting to draft up a letter for your members to use.  You could e-mail us at advocacy@ACB.org.  We do have a background document on this legislative imperative that is playing on the Washington connection.  So you could access it via audio.  As well as linked on the DC leadership page on the ACB website.  
Under the legislative imperatives.  
>>  All right.  Sounds great, thank you.  You are the best.  Take care.  Stay safe.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Thank you Dora.  
>>  Okay.  That is it.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: We have no other questions here in Zoom, or in the QA, or in Club House, Swatha what do you think about that point about the ensuring members of Congress know there are international guidelines that do exists?  Consensus guidelines that do exist.  Related to website accessibility.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: I do think it is a good starting point.  Your member of Congress doesn't know that there are these standards that they to learn with them and what could be required or could be required of companies.  That is a great template for like -- for rule-making or for sharing point.  Yeah.  
>>  We have a hand in Zoom.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Great.  
>>  Jamaica.  
>>  Yes.  My name is Jamaica from Georgia.  I wonder, what the -- what -- Congress means for the representatives for Congress.  And where should I find that Representative of Congress to e-mail?  E-mail him or her all about this?  As what I'm wondering, thank you.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely Swatha you like to begin?  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Sure.  So Congress is the governing body of legislatures of people that make laws.  That could influence all ways of life.  The ADA is a binding law that sets the rules for accessibility in people's environment.  That is a Bill passed by Congress.  And signed by the President.  
If you would like to find your Congress member or your Senator, your key, law maker you could go to house.gov or Senate.gov and put in your zip code or state where you live.  
>>  Thank you.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Thank you for that question we know you have great advocates in the council of the blind and working with your state affiliate, is a great way to participate in advocacy for the imperatives.  Thank you for the question and interests.  
>>  That is all for now Clark.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: You want to role-play with Senator from Maryland?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Oh.  Only if I could have -- I rather be -- Senator Rachfal representation central Florida and having one of my favorite Sheila pay me a visit.  
(laughing).  
>>  O'Lord have mercy.  
(laughing).  
You all didn't tell me this.  
(laughing).  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: We will blame it on Cindy she is not here.  
>>  No, she is not in the audience.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: You and the Florida council do great work.  You've got advocacy issue like that, what approach would ACB would take.  
>>  I wish Gabriel or Antony were here.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Raise the hand Gabe.  
>>  You know are you a congressman or Senator now?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: I'm pretty young in my career I'm a Representative.  
>>  Okay.  So congressman Rachfal we in Florida represent the Florida council of the blind are concerned about our web accessibility because we are not able to access many things including medical documents, checking in for doctor's appointments just registering to even check our flights status.  And you know trying to make an airline reservation to come to DC to meet you.  
So how can you help us and how can we make it better and will you support us in the web accessibility effort?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Ms. Sheila thank you for visiting me.  Have you personally encountered the barriers?  
>>  Oh yes, sir many times.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: What is a good example of a barrier you encountered online?  
>>  I recently tried to access my flight information when I come to DC.  And I was not able to access it.  I could not find my flight.  I could not figure out how to add it to my phone.  Which is apparently the way that everything is going in the world.  And not all individuals have Smartphones.  So what do we do about seniors that can't do web access?  How can we help them?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: You tell me the legislation would be able to help those seniors.  
>>  No, unfortunately not, but that is another topic.  
(laughing).  
But what I try to make a doctor's appointment.  They want me to check-in on the phone.  And --
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Okay I've had to do that.  
>>  I can't do that.  I can't figure out how -- I have a Smartphone.  But I'm not able to figure out how to access that link.  So, you know, how can we help them make it more accessible for us to check-in online?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: When you bring this to your doctor's attention what do they say?  
>>  They say just call us.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: So --
>>  That is not acceptable to me.  I feel like, if sighted people could do this, we should be able to do it as well.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Let's take a pause here.  That's a great -- I will call that a great pivot.  Because many cases, the primary method of accessing services or information is online; right?  A company may say, just give us a call.  Whether that is a doctor, an airline, you know, a business, we all know what happens when you call; right?  You get put on hold for hours upon hours on end.  And you are lucky if the person you speak with could help you with the one thing you were trying to do.  
But this takes more time, it takes more effort, you are missing out on everything else.  That could be done on the website.  Or on the application.  And done so privately and independently.  
>>  Right.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: So Sheila may have been trying to check-in for her doctor's appointment but in not being able to do that online, what else isn't she able to do?  She is not able to see what other appointments are available.  She may not be able to see when her medications need to be renewed.  She may not be able to tell they have the wrong insurance information.  
From an old file or old account or they could misspell her name; right?  Those are things that everyone with access to the -- telehealth or patient portal they are able to do.  Same with transportation.  Same with banking and same online ordering.  
So --
>>  We do have a hand raised.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Okay.  
>>  Probably from my approaching you.  
(laughing).  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Thank you Sheila you did a great job.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yes, you did.  
>>  Hey Clark and Swatha good evening.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Hi Leslie.  
>>  Good job Sheila very good.  I have a quick question not sure if you addressed it or not.  I feel -- I'm dealing with more websites now that is good for me I'm learning.  It is very frustrating.  You know, we talked about this last year Clark, I still have the problem with my fitness site.  I've tried to speak with them about making it accessible.  You know, they say yes, yes.  We're going to work on it.  We will work on it.   It is still not accessible.  My friend still need to help me get into fill out the form and help me do this and that.  It is not right.  I mean, this is my profession; right?  , You know, so I don't know exactly if there is something I can, you know, somewhere I could tell them where to go?  Make it -- like the standards that Ray said.  Are those things we could talk to our Congress people about.  This is my profession.  It is not accessible to me I need to get my CDC every two years.  
So I have to have my friends come over and help me get online to take the classes.  First of all, second, I need to have someone come back over after a month gone by after I took the classes to get my credits put into the form.  And then third of all I need another friend come to put it in to my certification.  And then I have to pay it online now.  
(laughing).  
So they want my money but not accessible.  What could I do?  You have suggestions for me?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Well the first suggestion, this is a perfect story to share with your member of Congress and with your Senators.  Because this impacts your employment.  Whether Democrats or Republicans, employing people with disabilities is a priority.  
You could come at it from one angle and say somebody with a disability is employed they are out there in the community.  They are earning money as opposed to receive government support; right?  They are integrated and active in their community.  They are engaged, they are present, like everyone else.  
But all of these barriers negatively impact your ability to do that.  To participate
>>  Right I'm not working anymore.  I'm working on me own.  You know, on my own volunteering.  That I love.  I'm still keeping up my CEC's and my profession because that is what I want to do.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Exactly.  
>> It should be accessible.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Exactly.  
>>  There are other people out there that are blind and visually impairs that want to work in gyms it could be happening to others and not know it.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Yeah, well these are -- these are items that -- that the ADA and this legislation that we're seeking to get reintroduced should cover.  It is certification courses for education and employment.  So happy to connect with you.  Separate from this call.  To talk about other possible advocacy avenues.  
Related to this issue.  You know, it makes me think of the bar exam course that was inaccessible.  Or the various testing certifications courses and programs with the government that have not been accessible over the years
>>  Right okay.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: There is clear precedence to say these technologies and programs and services must be made accessible.  Let's see if we could have a conversation to help move that forward.  
>>  Sounds great.  Thanks for all you are doing.  Keep advocate.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: As for you Leslie, please share this story with your member of Congress and Senators.  It is powerful.  
>>  Thank you.  
>>  Deb.  
>>  Hi this is Deb.  I'm in Oregon.  I'm a actually creating online courses for certification for mental health providers I also have a mental health provider.  This is very -- passionate about it.  Because, you know, serving monkey is accessible.  I talk to my legislatures you find they have a sense you are blind could you not use the computer.  I explain, that I went through three different sites and I found the more expensive the software is, e-mail marketing I will not mention the last one.  There are certain software companies I turn on Jaws it crashes I get the blue screen of death.  I went through them patiently until I found one that doesn't crash with Jaws.  Now, I have enough vision I could cheat or get an assistant.  I found I have to have electronic health reports for clients to appear.  I found one.  It will not let me sign-in.  So I have to keep Jaws off.  I learned to do tab, tab, twice.  And I do some crazy password filling in thing.  I hit enter.  Every time I talk to the companies and say, hey, all you have to do it make it a button or link.  I could do this.  
And they go, we don't have to.  It is part of our security.  Or they have these strange ideas.  And so we really need the legislation to show them it is okay.  What happens, everybody does spacing and I think it is important to let them know there are so many software that is accessible and it is all stuff that people could get at.  But all the stuff that is hidden behind a membership you need to a 150 a month or one case, 1,500 dollars a year, to use it, and it is private business and they are making a ton of money.  And it would not take them , you know, the one has index.  And instead of using a tab, to go down for the menu, they use spaces.  
So Jaws can't find the first letter of the menu because they have a space in front of it.  A different number of spaces.  Over time I used to use it anyway.  But I think it is important to let them know that there is lots of software that does work.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: I agree with you.  Cost is another great angle to talk about with your members of Congress or the companies.  That is cheaper.  These are accessible in most cases.  It is not like you need to reinvent the wheel.  It is easier to put it in than add it as an afterthought.  
>>  Yup.  It is important to know that, there is a lot of people out there that are working that need to use software.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely.  Thank you so much.  
>>  All right.  Jewel.  
>>  Am I unmuted.  
>>  Yes, ma'am.  
>>  I needed to unmute several times to unmute.  My question, I've been listening through the media skill.  My question is, if this passes, and websites and software have to be accessible, what is going to enforce that?  Because we already have issues with the ADA enforcement.  Where it is not a big deal it is not enforced.  There have -- it has to be a class action lawsuit before it is enforced.  I'm curious what will enforce this?  Is there something in place to try to change that?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: What a great question.  Swatha you like to talk about the -- so say this legislation is passed.  We have to go through the rule-making process.  The regulations are implemented.  How can people with disabilities enforce this law?  To ensure equal access?  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: So now this is dicey here.  Ideally you want to have the ability to kind of bring a suit or talk to the companies about their violation of the Bill.  Clark you want to elaborate?  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Absolutely.  Currently included in the legislation, as it was introduced in the last year, 117 Congress, there is a private right of action, for people with disabilities or organizations and entities.  What does private right of action mean?  It means that an individual or organization would be able to file a lawsuit with punitive damages.  For a violation of this act.  
Currently with the ADA, you could file a lawsuit and receive only injunctive relief that means they need to fix what is wrong.  And reasonable attorney fees.  
So having the ability to file a lawsuit, having the ability to receive damages, we think is a powerful incentive to encourage employers' and businesses to do the right thing.  To ensure they don't have a suit brought against them.  There are states around the United States that in their state laws, have allowed for punitive damages.  Financial damages to be awarded to people with disabilities.  
But that is not part of the American with disabilities act, the national framework.  That is an area where we feel this Bill, if passed, will strengthen the rights with people with disabilities when taking action to protect their rights.  
>>  She left.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: All right.  Pretty cool we had someone listening on the media skill that was passionate enough to jump into the community of Zoom and ask a question.  
>>  Yeah.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yeah.  
>>  We have -- don't have any hands.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: I'm sorry what was that Sheila.  
>>  We have no other hands here.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Nothing in the QA or Club House?  
>>  No, sir.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: All right.  Swatha you want to give a quick recap?  Of our legislative imperative The Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act?  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yes.  So this bill is standards for websites and applications to be accessible not just blind folks or low vision folks but all people with all kinds of disabilities.  So people from mobility, dexterity to cognition, this Bill really consumes all of that.  
So what we would want -- oh.  Sorry.  So what we asking you to do with your members of Congress is to -- share your story and share why this legislation is important to you.  
And why this needs to be passed.  And the need and the need of the legislation and let them know you want them to co-sponsor once it is introduced or original sponsor.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: That is right.  Swatha said, emphasize the need.  The problem.  We all encounter inaccessible websites applications and services.  On a daily bases.  All of those are reasons why this legislation is important.  
And how this --
>>  We did get a hand raise.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: All right.  We will quickly go to that question.  
>>  608, 219.  
>>  This is Peter.  I understand we have the right to file.  Under the -- under the present language.  As protest.  But I mean, we need to find enough money to hire a lawyer and give the initial fees and incur to get to a settlement time.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: That is a great question, Peter.  That is not addressed by this legislation.  That would depend on the relationship between the plaintiff and their counsel there are plenty of attorneys out there now that will take disability rights cases pro bono not all will.  There are attorneys and law firms out there that charge clients for taking a disability right's case.  There are others that will do it pro bono and receive attorney’s fees once upon victory in the case or as part of a settlement.  
So I'd say this legislation is not the appropriate vehicle to address that.  But that is -- that is a consideration that all of us need to make when pursuing legal advocacy.  
>>  Yeah.  Because I mean, it seems to be only the people with money are able to make the complaint and make it stick.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Well I understand why folks feel that way.  , you know, within ACB at our affiliates we are fortunate to work with a lot of great partners on behalf of our members.  Where that is not the case.  And I think there are folks out there doing really good work that have alternative compensation models to assist people with disabilities in filing complaints.  Thank you for the question.  Emphasize the need and problem.  And then, really, strongly encourage them, your members of Congress, Senators, to support the Websites and Software Applications Accessibility Act.  Why?  Because it requires the Department of Justice and the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission to create a uniform national framework.  It requires them to create enforceable regulations.  
It requires them to do that by date certain after passage of the Bill.  We will be in the situation now where the ADA was passes over 30 years ago.  But these regulations have not been completed.  
That's why we need the legislation.  We need them to force the Department of the Justice and EEOC to create the regulations to provide us the people with disabilities and the business communities the places of public accommodations.  The employers' out there.  So that they know what it means to be accessible and they know what it means to provide equal access.  To people with disabilities.  So again, there is still time to register.  
Although it is now late in the game.  There is time to register for the DC Leadership Conference.  I hope you could join us whether virtually, Saturday March 4-Tuesday March 7.  In-person Alexander Virginia, Thursday March 9-Sunday March 12 at the Hilton Old Town.  Swatha said, our rally for Accessible and Inclusive Currency on Friday March 10th.  So thank you for joining us this evening.  
And as always, Swatha.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Keep advocate.  
>>  We have one comment in the QA.  That is Gabriel that said I'm digging the Spanish translation.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Hip, hip, hooray and big thank you to the Spanish language interpreter and the CART Captioner to help us spread the word for the imperatives.  
>>  SWATHA NANDHAKUMAR: Yeah, thank you all.
>>  We're going to use this meeting location for a second to resolve a problem.  So the meeting will stay open but you all will leave because it is boring now.  
(laughing).  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: Thanks all.  How about the cool people with one -- I will start with the one syllable names.  Deb.  Bell.  Clark.  
>>  It is too much to rename them bigger.  
>>  There is two syllable.  Gabe.  And the two syllable name.  Sheila.  Swatha.  So long.  
>>  You forgot Larry.  
>>  CLARK RACHFAL: There is another one.  
>>  Rick.  
>>  It is still one and it still works.  
>>  I have to tell you, are we still streamed or no?  
>>  No.  We are done.  
(end of event 5:29 p.m. PST)